Moses, R' Yehuda HaNasi, and Rav Ashi: The Pinnacle of Torah and Secular Authority (Gittin 59a)
The Passage
Unparalleled Greatness: R' Yehuda HaNasi's Unique Combination of Torah Knowledge and Secular Power; With Eight Objections
Rabba son of Rava (רבה בריה דרבא), or possibly R' Hillel son of R' Walas,1 comments on the unique greatness of R' Yehuda HaNasi, asserting that from the days of Moses (c. 13th century BCE) to R' Yehuda HaNasi (c. 135 to 217 CE; so a period of over 1300 years), no single individual combined unparalleled Torah knowledge and secular greatness2 in one person.
Several objections are raised, citing major biblical figures subsequent to Moses. However, each objection is countered by noting that in their times, there were others who matched their Torah knowledge.
For four of the pairs (#4-7), the Talmud continues to object: “But Y died/was killed (נח נפשיה / קטליה - meaning, in X’s lifetime, leaving X the leading figure in both domains)!?” To which it answers: “all the years” (כולהו שני - meaning, from the days of Moses to the days of R' Yehuda HaNasi there was no other single individual who reigned supreme in Torah and greatness for all the years that he was the leader of the Jewish people.).
To summarize, the biblical figures mentioned are, in order (the Talmud mentions them in chronological order), with the corresponding person in their generation (in parentheses, the approximate century, BCE, when each one of these pairs lived.):3
Elazar - Pinehas (13th century)
Pinehas - the Elders (זקנים) (“”)
David - Ira the Jairite (עירא היאירי) (early 10th century)
Solomon - Shimi ben Gera (middle 10th century)
ואמר רבה בריה דרבא, ואיתימא רבי הילל בריה דרבי וולס:
מימות משה ועד רבי, לא מצינו תורה וגדולה במקום אחד.
ולא?!
הא הוה יהושע! הוה אלעזר.
הא הוה אלעזר! הוה פנחס.
והא הוה פנחס! הוו זקנים.
הא הוה שאול! הוה שמואל.
והא נח נפשיה! כולהו שני קאמרינן.
והא הוה דוד! הוה עירא היאירי.
והא נח נפשיה! כולהו שני בעינן.
הא הוה שלמה! הוה שמעי בן גרא.
והא קטליה! כולהו שני קאמרינן.
הא הוה חזקיה! הוה שבנא.
הא איקטיל! כולהו שני קאמרינן.
והא הוה עזרא! הוה נחמיה בן חכליה.
Rabba, son of Rava, says, and some say that it was R' Hillel, son of R' Volas, who says:
From the days of Moses and until the days of R' Yehuda HaNasi we do not find unparalleled greatness in Torah knowledge and unparalleled greatness in secular matters, including wealth and high political office, combined in one place, i.e., in a single individual.
The Gemara asks: But was there not such a person?!
Wasn’t there Joshua, who was unparalleled in both domains?
The Gemara answers: During his day there was Elazar, who was Joshua’s equal in Torah knowledge.
The Gemara asks: Wasn’t there Elazar, who outlived Joshua?
The Gemara answers: During his day, there was Pinehas, who was Elazar’s equal in Torah knowledge.
The Gemara objects: Wasn’t there Pinehas, who outlived Elazar?
The Gemara answers: There were the Elders, who were equal to Pinehas in Torah knowledge.
The Gemara further objects: Wasn’t there Saul, who was unparalleled in both domains?
The Gemara answers: There was Samuel, who was Saul’s equal in Torah knowledge.
The Gemara asks: But didn’t Samuel pass away in Saul’s lifetime, leaving Saul the leading figure in both domains?
The Gemara answers: We meant to say that from the days of Moses to the days of R' Yehuda HaNasi there was no other single individual who reigned supreme in Torah and greatness for all the years that he was the leader of the Jewish people.
The Gemara asks: But wasn’t there David, who was both the greatest Torah authority and the most powerful temporal authority of his day?
The Gemara answers: There was Ira the Jairite, who was David’s equal in Torah knowledge.
The Gemara objects: But didn’t Ira the Jairite pass away in David’s lifetime?
The Gemara answers: In order to qualify for this designation, we require that he be the leading figure in both Torah and high office for all the years that he is the leader of the Jewish people.
The Gemara asks: Wasn’t there Solomon, who was unparalleled in both domains?
The Gemara answers: During his day there was Shimi ben Gera, who was Solomon’s master in Torah knowledge.
The Gemara objects: But didn’t Solomon kill him at the beginning of his reign (see I Kings, chapter 2)?
The Gemara answers: We meant to say that from the days of Moses to the days of R' Yehuda HaNasi there was no other single individual who reigned supreme in Torah and greatness all of his years.
The Gemara further objects: Wasn’t there Hezekiah, who was both the leading Torah scholar of his age and also the king of his people?
The Gemara answers: There was Shebnah in that generation, who was Hezekiah’s equal in Torah knowledge.
The Gemara asks: Wasn’t he killed in the war against Sennacherib?
The Gemara answers: We meant to say that there was no similar individual who reigned supreme in both Torah and high office all of his years.
The Gemara asks: But wasn’t there Ezra, who was the greatest Torah sage of his day and the leader of the Jewish people?
The Gemara answers: There was Nehemiah ben Hacaliah who was his equal.
Unmatched Greatness: Rav Ashi's Era and the Subordination of Huna bar Natan
Rav Aḥa son of Rava asserts a similar claim for the period from R' Yehuda HaNasi (as mentioned above, c. 135 to 217 CE) to Rav Ashi (352–427 CE).4
When Huna bar Natan is mentioned as a possible exception, the Talmud explains that Huna bar Natan was subordinate (כייף) to Rav Ashi, thus not matching the unique combination of supreme Torah knowledge and secular greatness.
אמר רב אחא בריה דרבא:
אף אני אומר, מימות רבי ועד רב אשי, לא מצינו תורה וגדולה במקום אחד.
ולא?!
והא הוה הונא בר נתן!
שאני הונא בר נתן, דמיכף הוה כייף ליה לרב אשי.
Rav Aḥa, son of Rava, says:
I also say something similar, that from the days of R' Yehuda HaNasi and until the days of Rav Ashi, we do not find unparalleled greatness in Torah knowledge and unparalleled greatness in secular matters, including wealth and high political office, combined in one place, i.e., in a single individual.
The Gemara asks: But was there not such a person?!
But wasn’t there Huna bar Natan, who enjoyed both great Torah scholarship and great wealth, who lived during the time of Rav Ashi?
The Gemara answers: Huna bar Natan is different, as he himself was subordinate to Rav Ashi, who was his superior in both domains.
רבי הילל בריה דרבי וולס. On this name, see Jastrow (I expanded abbreviations, and made stylistic adjustments for readability):
proper name male (Οὐάλης [Ouálēs], Valens) Valis, an Amora, father of R. Hillel. Gittin 59a; Sanhedrin 36a (Manuscript Munich ולס, Aruch edition Kohut וילס); Yerushalmi Kilayim chapter 2, 32a top; ibid. chapter 1, 27a top אלס.
Yerushalmi Ḥallah chapter 1, 57c bottom חליס (edition Krotoschin ה׳, read: וו׳).
See Frankel’s Mebo Yerushalmi page 76.
Compare בָּאלִי.
Compare Wikipedia, “Valens“:
Valens [Sometimes enumerated as Valens II, after Valerius Valens (r. 316–317).] (Greek: Ουάλης, translit. Ouálēs; 328 – 9 August 378) was Roman emperor from 364 to 378.
And see others with this name in Wikipedia, “Valens (disambiguation)“:
Valens (usurper), probably Iulius Valens Licinianus, usurper (250) under emperor Decius
Fabius Valens, Roman general under Emperor Nero (died 69)
Vettius Valens, astrologer (died c. 175)
Valens Thessalonicus, usurper under Emperor Gallienus (261)
גדולה - presumably including both wealth and political power.
For the dating of kings, see Wikipedia, “Kings of Israel and Judah”, which I rely on also in my piece here, section “Three Biblical Kings and Four Biblical Commoners Who Have No Share in the World-to-Come”.