Pt1 R’ Elazar ben Shimon: His Life and Afterlife (Bava Metzia 84b-85a)

This is the first part of a two-part series. The outline of the series is below.

This sugya is focused on the figure of R’ Elazar ben Shimon.¹ A disciple of both halakha and suffering, he is portrayed as voluntarily accepting afflictions as atonement for the sins of his generation. Despite this extreme asceticism, his clarity in legal rulings remains intact—validated when all women he ruled to be not a niddah bear male children.

R’ Elazar ben Shimon’s life unfolds in phases: bodily affliction, marital collapse, sudden wealth, and posthumous reverence. After death, his body remains miraculously preserved in an attic for up to 22 years, issuing legal decisions from beyond the grave. Only public outcry—and a dream appearance from his father, R’ Shimon ben Yoḥai—brings about his burial.

A sharp subplot follows: R’ Yehuda HaNasi attempts to marry the widow, but she rebukes him, emphasizing the spiritual superiority of her late husband. Their rivalry, rooted in an earlier demotion episode, offers a glimpse into the politics of rabbinic leadership.

The second half of the sugya transitions to the next generation. R’ Elazar ben Shimon’s wayward son, known for his beauty and promiscuity, is rehabilitated through R’ Yehuda HaNasi’s intervention and becomes R’ Yosei, a scholar whose voice echoes that of his father. This theme of redemptive Torah continuity is mirrored in a near-identical case involving R’ Tarfon’s descendant.

Outline

Intro

The Passage - R’ Elazar ben Shimon: His Life and Afterlife (Bava Metzia 84b-85a)

Part 1: R’ Elazar ben Shimon’s suffering-filled life

1. R’ Elazar ben Shimon accepts extreme afflictions upon himself as atonement for possible sins

2. He welcomes afflictions as “brothers and friends” at night, dismisses them at dawn; Wife overhears his pain invitation, accuses him of self-destruction, and leaves him

3. Sailors gift him wealth, slaves, and food

4. He eats, recovers completely, and returns to the study hall

5. He recovers and resumes study; He is vindicated halakhically when all women whose menstrual niddah blood he ruled pure give birth to boys; All children born are male and named “Elazar” after him

Part 2: R’ Elazar ben Shimon’s Death, posthumous reverence, and burial

1. Asks wife to store his body in attic, fearing rabbinic hostility over his past actions

2. Body remains uncorrupted in attic for 18 to 22 years

3. Hair intact with blood

4. Voice issues from attic resolving legal disputes between litigants

5. Why he was buried: Two versions

   1. Neighbor’s curse reveals situation; rabbis decide burial is now necessary

   2. R’ Shimon ben Yoḥai appears requesting burial of his “single fledgling”

6. Burial

7. Serpent encircles father’s cave but yields when asked to admit “son to father”

Part 3: R’ Yehuda HaNasi’s relationship with R’ Elazar ben Shimon

1. R’ Yehuda HaNasi proposes to R’ Elazar ben Shimon’s widow; she rejects the offer using sacred/profane vessel metaphor

2. Widow claims R’ Elazar was greater in Torah and definitely in pious deeds

3. Flashback: Young R’ Elazar and R’ Yehuda HaNasi studied together, impressing masters

4. Both promoted to benches, then demoted due to fathers’ concerns about evil eye; R’ Elazar becomes offended at being equated with R’ Yehuda HaNasi

5. Their relationship shifts from support to R’ Elazar preempting and dismissing R’ Yehuda HaNasi; Rabban Shimon ben Gamliel consoles R’ Yehuda HaNasi: “he is lion son of lion, you are lion son of fox”

6. R’ Yehuda HaNasi - There are three modest people: Rabban Shimon ben Gamliel, the Sons of Beteira, and Jonathan son of Saul

Part 4: R’ Elazar ben Shimon’s son

1. R’ Elazar’s son is beautiful but promiscuous. R’ Yehuda HaNasi redeems him, entrusts him to R’ Shimon ben Isi, and he becomes the sage R’ Yosei

2. His voice reminds R’ Yehuda HaNasi of his father.

3. When R’ Yosei dies, a serpent blocks access to his father’s cave. A bat kol explains that R’ Elazar’s merit was his suffering in the cave, which R’ Yosei did not share.

4. A similar redemption story occurs with R’ Tarfon’s grandson, who is also rescued from disgrace by R’ Yehuda HaNasi, potentially through a marriage offer.

Appendix - R’ Yehuda HaNasi’s suffering

1. R’ Yehuda HaNasi’s 13 years of afflictions: kidney stones and scurvy

2. R’ Yehuda HaNasi’s pain is so intense it outpaces the roar of his livestock.

The Passage

Bava_Metzia.84b.1 to Bava_Metzia.85a.15

Part 1: R’ Elazar ben Shimon’s suffering-filled life

R’ Elazar ben Shimon accepts extreme afflictions upon himself as atonement for possible sins

ואפילו הכי לא סמך רבי אלעזר ברבי שמעון אדעתיה,

קביל עליה יסורי

§ After this digression, the Talmud returns to the story of R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon.

And although his flesh did not putrefy, even so R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon, still did not rely on his own opinion (דעתיה), as he was worried that he may have erred in one of his decisions.

He accepted afflictions upon himself as atonement for his possible sins.

1. באורתא --

   1. הוו מייכי ליה שיתין נמטי,

2. לצפרא --

   1. נגדי מתותיה שיתין משיכלי דמא וכיבא.

3. למחר --

   1. עבדה ליה דביתהו שיתין מיני לפדא, ואכיל להו וברי.

ולא הות שבקא ליה דביתהו למיפק לבי מדרשא

כי היכי דלא לדחקוהו רבנן.

1. At night --

   1. his attendants would spread out 60 felt (נמטי) bed coverings for him.

2. In the morning --

   1. despite the bed coverings, they would remove 60 basins (משיכלי) of blood and pus from underneath him.

3. The following day, i.e., every morning --

   1. his wife would prepare for him 60 types of relish [lifda] made from figs, and he would eat them and become healthy.

His wife, concerned for his health, would not allow him to go to the study hall,

so that the Rabbis would not push him beyond his limits.

He welcomes afflictions as “brothers and friends” at night, dismisses them at dawn; Wife overhears his pain invitation, accuses him of self-destruction, and leaves him

• באורתא אמר להו:

  • אחיי ורעי, בואו!

• בצפרא אמר להו:

  • זילו מפני ביטול תורה

• In the evening, he would say to his pains:

  • My brothers and my friends, come!

• In the morning he would say to them:

  • Go away, due to the dereliction of Torah (ביטול תורה) study that you cause me.

יומא חד

שמעה דביתהו,

אמרה ליה:

את קא מייתית להו עילויך!

כלית ממון של בית אבא.

אימרדה,

אזלה לבית נשא.

One day

his wife heard him inviting his pains.

She said to him:

You are bringing the pains upon yourself.

You have diminished the money of my father’s home due to the costs of treating your self-imposed afflictions.

She rebelled² against him

and went back to her father’s home, and he was left with no one to care for him.

Sailors gift him wealth, slaves, and food

סליקו ואתו הנך [שיתין] ספונאי,

עיילו ליה שיתין עבדי

כי נקיטי שיתין ארנקי,

ועבדו ליה שיתין מיני לפדא

ואכיל להו.

Meanwhile, there were these 60 sailors³ who came and entered to visit R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon.

They brought him 60 slaves,

each bearing 60 purses,

and prepared him 60 types of relish

and he ate them.

יומא חד,

אמרה לה לברתה:

זילי בקי באבוך

מאי קא עביד האידנא?

אתיא,

אמר לה:

זילי אמרי לאימיך:

שלנו, גדול משלהם.

One day,

the wife of R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon, said to her daughter:

Go and check on your father

and see what he is doing now.

The daughter came to her father,

who said to her:

Go and tell your mother that

ours is greater than theirs, i.e., my current financial status is greater than that of your father’s household.

He eats, recovers completely, and returns to the study hall

קרי אנפשיה:

״היתה כאניות סוחר

ממרחק תביא לחמה״.

אכל

ושתי

וברי

נפק לבי מדרשא.

He read the verse about himself:

“She is like the merchant-ships;

she brings her food from afar” (Proverbs 31:14).

R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon, ate

and drank

and became healthy

and went out to the study hall.⁴

He recovers and resumes study; He is vindicated halakhically when all women whose menstrual niddah blood he ruled pure give birth to boys; All children born are male and named “Elazar” after him

אייתו לקמיה שיתין מיני דמא

טהרינהו

The students brought 60 questionable samples of blood before him for inspection, to determine whether or not they were menstrual blood, in regards to niddah.

He deemed them all ritually pure, thereby permitting the women to have sex with their husbands.

הוה קא מרנני רבנן ואמרי:

סלקא דעתך לית בהו חד ספק?!

אמר להו:

• אם כמותי הוא –

  • יהיו כולם זכרים,

• ואם לאו –

  • תהא נקבה אחת ביניהם.

היו כולם זכרים.

ואסיקו להו ״רבי אלעזר״ על שמיה.

The Rabbis of the academy were murmuring (מרנני) about R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon, and saying:

Can it enter your mind that there is not one uncertain sample among them?! He must be mistaken.

R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon, said to them:

• If the halakha is in accordance with my ruling --

  • let all the children born from these women be males.

• And if not --

  • let there be one female among them.

It turned out that all of the children were males,

and they were called “Elazar” in his name.⁵

תניא,

אמר רבי:

כמה פריה ורביה ביטלה רשעה זו מישראל

It is taught in a baraita that

R’ Yehuda HaNasi lamented and said concerning the wife of R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon:

How much procreation (פריה ורביה) has this evil woman prevented from the Jewish people.

She caused women not to have children by preventing her husband from going to the study hall and rendering his halakhic rulings.

Part 2: R’ Elazar ben Shimon’s Death, posthumous reverence, and burial

Asks wife to store his body in attic, fearing rabbinic hostility over his past actions

כי הוה קא ניחא נפשיה,

אמר לה לדביתהו:

ידענא בדרבנן דרתיחי עלי,

ולא מיעסקי בי שפיר.

אוגנין בעיליתאי

ולא תדחלין מינאי.

As R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon, was dying,

he said to his wife:

I know that the Rabbis are angry (רתיחי) at me⁶

and therefore they will not properly tend to my burial.

When I die, lay me (אוגנין) in my attic

and do not be afraid (תדחלין) of me, i.e., do not fear that anything will happen to my corpse.

Body remains uncorrupted in attic for 18 to 22 years

1. אמר רבי שמואל בר נחמני:

2. אישתעיא לי אימיה דרבי יונתן,

3. דאישתעיא לה דביתהו דרבי אלעזר ברבי שמעון:

לא פחות מתמני סרי,

ולא טפי מעשרין ותרין שנין

אוגניתיה בעיליתא.

1. R’ Shmuel bar Naḥmani said:

2. R’ Yonatan’s mother told me that

3. the wife of R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon, told her:

for no less than 18 years

and for no more than 22 years

I laid him in the attic

Hair intact with blood

כי הוה סליקנא מעיננא ליה במזייה,

כי הוה משתמטא ביניתא מיניה

הוה אתי דמא

His wife continued: When I would go up to the attic I would check his hair,

and when a hair would fall out from his head,

blood would come and appear in its place, i.e., his corpse did not decompose.

יומא חד

חזאי ריחשא דקא נפיק מאוניה,

חלש דעתאי.

איתחזי לי בחלמא

אמר לי:

לא מידי הוא,

יומא חד

שמעי בזלותא דצורבא מרבנן

ולא מחאי כדבעי לי.

One day

I saw a worm⁷ emerging from his ear,

and I became very distressed that perhaps his corpse had begun to decompose.

My husband appeared to me in a dream

and said to me: It is no matter for concern.

Rather, this is a consequence for a sin of mine, as one day

I heard a Torah scholar being insulted (זלותא)

and I did not protest as I should have.

Therefore, I received this punishment in my ear, measure for measure.

Voice issues from attic resolving legal disputes between litigants

כי הוו אתו בי תרי לדינא,

הוו קיימי אבבא,

• אמר מר מילתיה

• ומר מילתיה

נפיק קלא מעיליתיה, ואמר:

• איש פלוני אתה חייב,

• איש פלוני אתה זכאי.

During this period, when two people would come for adjudication (דינא) of a dispute,

they would stand by the doorway to the home of R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon.

• One litigant would state his side of the matter,

• and the other litigant would state his side of the matter.

A voice would issue forth from his attic, saying:

• So-and-so (איש פלוני), you are guilty;

• so-and-so, you are innocent.

Why he was buried: Two versions

Neighbor’s curse reveals situation; rabbis decide burial is now necessary

יומא חד

הוה קא מינציא דביתהו בהדי שבבתא,

אמרה לה: תהא כבעלה שלא ניתן לקבורה.

אמרי רבנן: כולי האי ודאי לאו אורח ארעא.

The Talmud relates: One day,

the wife of R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon, was quarreling (מינציא) with a neighbor.

The neighbor said to her as a curse: This woman should be like her husband, who was not buried.⁸

When word spread that R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon, had not been buried, the Rabbis said: This much, i.e., now that the matter is known, to continue in this state is certainly not proper conduct, and they decided to bury him.

R’ Shimon ben Yoḥai appears requesting burial of his “single fledgling”

איכא דאמרי:

רבי שמעון בן יוחאי איתחזאי להו בחלמא,

אמר להו:

פרידה אחת יש לי ביניכם,

ואי אתם רוצים להביאה אצלי?!

There are those who say that

the rabbis found out that R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon, had not been buried when R’ Shimon ben Yoḥai, his father, appeared to them in a dream

and said to them:

I have a single fledgling (פרידה) among you, i.e., my son,

and you do not wish to bring it to me by burying him next to me.⁹

Burial

אזול רבנן לאעסוקי ביה,

לא שבקו בני עכבריא,

דכל שני דהוה ניים רבי אלעזר ברבי שמעון בעיליתיה —

לא סליק חיה רעה למתייהו.

Consequently, the rabbis went to tend to his burial.

The residents of Akbaria (עכבריא), the town where the corpse of R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon, was resting, did not allow them to do so,

as they realized that all the years that R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon, had been resting in his attic —

no wild beast had entered their town.

The townspeople attributed this phenomenon to his merit and they did not want to lose this protection.

Serpent encircles father’s cave but yields when asked to admit “son to father”

יומא חד

מעלי יומא דכיפורי הוה,

הוו טרידי.

שדרו רבנן לבני בירי

ואסקוהו לערסיה

ואמטיוה למערתא דאבוה

One day,

which was erev Yom Kippur,

everyone in the town was preoccupied with preparations for Yom Kippur.

The Rabbis sent a message to the residents of the adjacent town of Biri (בירי) instructing them to help remove the body of R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon, from the attic,

and they removed his bier

and brought it to his father’s burial cave.

אשכחוה לעכנא דהדרא לה למערתא.

אמרו לה:

עכנא עכנא!

פתחי פיך

ויכנס בן אצל אביו.

פתח[ה] להו.

They found a serpent [akhna] that had placed its tail in its mouth and completely encircled the entrance to the cave, denying them access.

They said to it:

Serpent, serpent!

Open your mouth¹⁰

to allow a son to enter next to his father.

It opened its mouth for them and uncoiled, and they buried R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon, alongside his father.

1. Fl. late 2nd century CE in Eretz Yisrael.

This sugya is a continuation of an extended aggadic sugya, see my two-part series on that: “Thief-Catching, Corpulence, and Virility: Stories of R’ Elazar ben Shimon and R’ Yishmael ben Yosei (Bava Metzia 83b-84a)“, final part: Pt2.

For scholarship on this sugya, see Ido Hevroni in JSIJ 24 (2024), with previous scholarship cited:

אחריתו של רבי אלעזר: ניתוח ספרותי ועריכתי של המחצית השניי ה של מחזור הסיפורים בבבלי בבא מציעא פג ע”ב – פד ע”ב

2. אימרדה.

In the Talmud, “rebelling” (מרד) frequently functions as a marital term, referring to a wife’s withdrawal from her husband or her refusal to fulfill marital obligations. Given that, under halakha, a woman cannot formally initiate divorce, such conduct becomes the primary mode of separation rather than divorce itself.

On this word, see Hebrew Wiktionary, sense #2, my translation:

Reneged an obligation; acted as though released from his obligations.

And see Jastrow (modernized):

מָרַד I

to rebel, refuse obedience; to protest.

• Mishnah Ketubot 5:7 - המוֹרֶדֶת על בעלה - “she who rebels against her husband (refusing marital duties; other opinion: refusing to work).”

• Ibid. - המוֹרֵד על אשתו - “a husband refusing marital duties (other opinion: refusing to give her work and support)”

[…]

Hifil - הִמְרִיד to make rebellious, to incite.

• Yerushalmi Ketubot 5, 30b bottom of page - התורה הִמְרַדְתָּהּ עליו - “the Law requires her to be rebellious against him (to refuse sex)”

And ibid.:

מְרַד

[…]

Itpeel - אִימְּרִיד to become rebellious, run away.

• Ketubot 63b:9 - אִימְּרִידָא Rashi (ed. אִימְרְדָה, Alfasi אִימְרְדָא) - “ran away (from her husband)”

• Bava Metzia 84b:3 - אימרדה אזלה וכ׳ (Manuscript Munich: אימרי׳, see מְרִי) - “she ran away and went to her paternal home”

And ibid.:

מֶרֶד I

[running away, running against, compare מַעַל,] desertion, rebellion.

[…]

איגרת מ׳ a document stating a wife’s, or a husband’s, refusal of duties, see מָרַד I.

• Ketubot 64a:3; Yerushalmi ibid. 5, 30b bottom of page;

• Jerusalem Talmud Kiddushin 1:2:7 bottom of page;

• and frequently.

3. ספונאי.

Ed. Steinsaltz interprets:

When they had encountered trouble at sea, these sailors had prayed to be saved in the merit of R’ Elazar, son of R’ Shimon. Upon returning to dry land, they presented him with these gifts.

Another possibility is that these sailors were in fact supernatural beings, compare my “Pt2 From Desperation to Downpour: Talmudic Stories of Rainmaking (Taanit 24a-b)“, section “Rav Yehuda’s Anger, the Famine, and Elijah’s Intervention“, where I summarize:

Meanwhile, Rav Mari, son of Shmuel’s daughter witnessed a miraculous event where angels incarnated as sailors (מלאכי דאידמו למלחי) turned sand into flour, though he advised people not to buy it, as natural wheat would arrive the next day from Parzina (פרזינא).

4. Ed. Steinsaltz explains:

As he was unhindered by his wife from going to the study hall

However, a more straightforward explanation is that the change was due to the sailors bringing him additional resources, thus enabling him to regain his health; his wife had only kept him from the study hall because he was unwell.

5. Compare the same trope in a recent piece of mine, where the babies are named “Nathan” after R’ Natan the Babylonian.

6. Ed. Steinsaltz interprets:

for arresting several thieves who are their relatives

On this, see the previous part of the sugya, cited in my first note: “Thief-Catching, Corpulence, and Virility: Stories of R’ Elazar ben Shimon and R’ Yishmael ben Yosei (Bava Metzia 83b-84a)“.

7. ריחשא - i.e. a maggot, which seemingly indicated that his body was starting to decompose.

On this word, see Jastrow (modernized):

רְחֵשׁ

, worm, reptile, insect.

• Onkelos Genesis 1:20 (h. text שרץ).

• Onkelos Exodus 16:20 (h. text תולעים).

• Targum ibid. 24 (h. text רמה).

• Onkelos Leviticus 11:20, sq.

• Onkelos Leviticus 5:2 (O. ed. Vienna רָחִיש); and frequently.

• Bava Metzia 84b:9 - חזאי ר׳ דקא וכ׳ - “I saw a worm come out of his ear”

• Jerusalem Talmud Yevamot 15:2:2 - דר׳ שכיח - “at a season when the bite of a reptile is of frequent occurrence”

• and elsewhere.

And ibid.:

רַחַשׁ

(the preceding word)

a creeping thing, reptile.

• Mishnah Terumot 8:4 - כדי שיצא הר׳ וכ׳ - “as long as it would take a poisonous reptile to come forth … and drink”

• Chullin 10a.

And ibid.:

רְחַשׁ

to move, creep; to swarm, bring forth.

• Onkelos Genesis 1:26;

• Onkelos Genesis 1:28;

• Onkelos Genesis 1:30 (h. text רמש).

• Ibid. O. 20 (Yerushalmi יְרַחֲשׁוּן Pa.; Hebrew:text שרץ).

• Aramaic Targum to Psalms 105:30;

• and frequently.

And ibid.:

רָחַשׁ

(Biblical Hebrew)

[…]

Hifil - הִרְחִישׁ to swarm, come forth (of worms); to bring forth (worms).

• Kohelet Rabbah 5:10:2 (referring to Job 25:6) - "אלו תולעים שמַרְחִישִׁין תחתיו במותו - “that means the worms which come forth under him when he is dead”

• Bereishit Rabbah 23 - התחיל המת מרחיש (not מרחש) - “corpses began to beget worms”

• and elsewhere.

And compare my discussion elsewhere re the word sheretz (שרץ), which has a very similar semantic range.

8. See a similar trope in my “Appendix - Agricultural Foreknowledge From the Dead: A Pious Man Learns Seasonal Decrees of Hail and Blight by Overhearing Spirits in a Cemetery (Berakhot 18b)“, section “A quarrel breaks out between his wife and the mother of the buried girl, during which the secret of the mat of reeds becomes public“.

9. Compare the extended story of R’ Shimon ben Yohai, in my two-part series, “R’ Shimon’s Flight from the Romans, Hiding, and Return: A Story of Persecution, Miracles, and Retribution (Shabbat 33b-34a)“, final part here.

And see my “Appendix 2 - The hierarchy of righteous people who perceive the Shekhina: row of the righteous before God extends 18,000 parasangs; 36 righteous people; 1,000 righteous people, or 100, or only 2 (Sanhedrin 97b)”, section “R’ Shimon bar Yoḥai - “I have seen members of the group of the spiritually prominent, who are truly righteous, and they are few; and I and my son are among them” - 1,000, or 100, or only 2“.

10. Compare Wikipedia, “Ouroboros“:

The ouroboros […] is an ancient symbol depicting a snake or dragon eating its own tail.

And compare also my “The Laughing Sage and the Stung Scholar: The Story of the Osctracism of the Rabbi With the Bad Reputation (Moed Katan 17a)”, section “Pt3 - Death by being stung by a wasp on his penis, and burial in a cave“, where it’s likely implicit in his corpse “not being accepted” to various caves.